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 Bands you just can't get into.

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NTNR
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PostSubject: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:17 am

OK, we've all listened to bands on the recommendations of others and either found new loves or new avoids. Either way, there are some bands that are hyped beyond stupidity and you for some reason "just don't get it". What bands do others love but you just can't stand?

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:19 am

For me a few would be:

Opeth
Electric Wizard
Hooded Menace
Coffins
Neurosis

These are bands I have tried to get into but just can't for the life of me; and as a result I hate them (although Hooded Menace get bonus points for having a cool name and Coffins don't piss me off as much as they used too).

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:03 pm

Theres quite a few, but Crowbar stand out, i just dont get it. They seem like they are holding back and not going balls out. i dunno...Vocals too clean for "sludge"

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:14 pm

Soggy Bob wrote:
Theres quite a few, but Crowbar stand out, i just dont get it. They seem like they are holding back and not going balls out. i dunno...Vocals too clean for "sludge"


Agreed, I dislike the vocals as well.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:50 pm

Melvins, Napalm Death since Harmony “Morrisound-f****d-death-metal” Corruption, Neurosis, Sunn O))), Khanate and last but not least Blood Ceremony.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 1:14 pm

Gerhard wrote:
Melvins, Napalm Death since Harmony “Morrisound-f****d-death-metal” Corruption, Neurosis, Sunn O))), Khanate and last but not least Blood Ceremony.


I've personally always liked the experimental mid-period Napalm the best. Not sure how I feel about Corruption. They're aren't bad per sey but I know there's better out there. Sunn O))) is very take or leave and something I really have to be in the mood to hear. I've never really given Khanate a fair chance. A former friend of mine was really into them before I liked Doom and his hype more or less killed any interest that I may have had in them. I've been meaning to give them another chance. The Melvins are amusing but I think I'll have to agree with you on not liking them.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:18 pm

Most of mine have already been covered in other threads. So called goth doom - My Dying Bride, Type O Negative, Paradise Lost, Katatonia blah blah blah, the list goes on and on for that scene.

The Melvins - never got whats so good about them and I have tried to like them, I even bought albums on the off-chance I might them but that didn't work.

Neurosis - loved their first couple of albums but since then, have been pretty bored by everything they have done.

Queens Of The Stone Age - never heard a song I like.

In doom metal there is not many bands I can say I hate, I can listen to just about all of them if I am in the mood including some I have mentioned here. In other styles of metal though, the list is endless starting with the big 4 - Metallica, Slayer, Megadeth and Anthrax are all bands I have NEVER liked too much. Back in 83-86, I must have been the only metal head not into these bands at the time. To me there was many other bands that were much better and didn't get the credit they deserved.

And don't get me started on black metal, that list would go one forever. Very overrated genre of heavy metal IMO.


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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 5:22 pm

Cradle of Filth
My Dying Bride
Anathema
The Melvins
Draconian
Most grindcore bands
Norwegian black metal
Dream Theater

Hmmm there is a lot more, I will have to come back to this.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:45 pm

I will tell you one band I have a problem with - Clutch. Apart from a few songs, nothing has ever grabbed me with that band.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:22 pm

Neurosis - other than certain songs i.e. The Doorway, Locust Star and a few others, not really into them
Melvins - I really like the older stuff i.e. Gluey Porch Treatments, Ozma, and I saw them in the early 90s a few times and like it alot, Not into most of the stuff after the Solo LPS
Grindcore, especially Pornogrind, I didnt find songs about raping and shitting on someones corpse funny or shocking when i was 12 and do even less so now. maybe i should start a porno doom band and show them how to be creative and funny, no, thats a wast of time too
Most drone, 20minutes of 1 chord? no thank you, its an acquired taste I guess, i have friends that swear by it, just not for me, maybe i should try drugs first
Bottle Doom Lazy Band, I had a few friends rave about them but i just wanted to shove icepicks in my ears when the vocals started
A lot of black metal, I am thinking of starting a segment called Black Metal band or Yoko Ono, because honestly the vocals are much different a lot of times, liek a stuck pig fucking a dying cow
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:24 pm

Also on the new Crestfallen out this week, I play some of the bands mentioned here (paradise lost, my dying bride, anathema) haha, but i stick to their debut releases as they are the ones i love.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 2:57 am


-Opeth
-Katatonia
-Anathema
-Amorphis
-Paradise Lost
-Ozzy Osbourne (Solo)
-Saint-Vitus
-Swallow the Sun
-Saturnus
In fact, too much to mention 'em all...

@Crestfallen: Can't agree more with you about The Bottle Doom Lazy Band!
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:54 am

@Wedding in Hades

I love a lot of those bands, listen harder, lol Razz

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:19 am

NTNR wrote:
@Wedding in Hades

I love a lot of those bands, listen harder, lol Razz


But I tried you know Very Happy
In fact my wife actually loves most of these bands.
I agree Katatonia, Anathema or Paradise Lost can do really good stuffs with great dark atmosphere, but on the other hand I'm quickly bored by their albums especially due to the vocals which sound a little too close to pop-music IMO (I mean there's a lack of aggressivity which I can't stand too long).

But I really Do Not like Amorphis & Swallow the Sun.



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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:28 am

Wedding in Hades wrote:
NTNR wrote:
@Wedding in Hades

I love a lot of those bands, listen harder, lol Razz


But I tried you know Very Happy
In fact my wife actually loves most of these bands.
I agree Katatonia, Anathema or Paradise Lost can do really good stuffs with great dark atmosphere, but on the other hand I'm quickly bored by their albums especially due to the vocals which sound a little too close to pop-music IMO (I mean there's a lack of aggressivity which I can't stand too long).

But I really Do Not like Amorphis & Swallow the Sun.



Vocals too close to pop music? Sounds like you're listening to the wrong releases. You would be hard pressed to find pop vocals on Lost Paradise, Dance of December Souls, Serenades (although Sleepless has clean goth vocals), and The Karelian Isthmus. Swallow the Sun is admittedly more accessible than those bands on their early albums, but I still don't think I would call them pop.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:28 am

Crestfallen wrote:
Neurosis - other than certain songs i.e. The Doorway, Locust Star and a few others, not really into them
Melvins - I really like the older stuff i.e. Gluey Porch Treatments, Ozma, and I saw them in the early 90s a few times and like it alot, Not into most of the stuff after the Solo LPS
Grindcore, especially Pornogrind, I didnt find songs about raping and shitting on someones corpse funny or shocking when i was 12 and do even less so now. maybe i should start a porno doom band and show them how to be creative and funny, no, thats a wast of time too
Most drone, 20minutes of 1 chord? no thank you, its an acquired taste I guess, i have friends that swear by it, just not for me, maybe i should try drugs first
Bottle Doom Lazy Band, I had a few friends rave about them but i just wanted to shove icepicks in my ears when the vocals started
A lot of black metal, I am thinking of starting a segment called Black Metal band or Yoko Ono, because honestly the vocals are much different a lot of times, liek a stuck pig fucking a dying cow



Yeah that porno grind stuff, I mean where did that come from? It is truly horrible.
Drone is a acquired taste, I am very picky about that genre. At least 90% of it is just boring and pointless. I refuse to review a lot of those bands, it is just not worth my time and effort.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:31 am

Jayke wrote:
Wedding in Hades wrote:
NTNR wrote:
@Wedding in Hades

I love a lot of those bands, listen harder, lol Razz


But I tried you know Very Happy
In fact my wife actually loves most of these bands.
I agree Katatonia, Anathema or Paradise Lost can do really good stuffs with great dark atmosphere, but on the other hand I'm quickly bored by their albums especially due to the vocals which sound a little too close to pop-music IMO (I mean there's a lack of aggressivity which I can't stand too long).

But I really Do Not like Amorphis & Swallow the Sun.



Vocals too close to pop music? Sounds like you're listening to the wrong releases. You would be hard pressed to find pop vocals on Lost Paradise, Dance of December Souls, Serenades (although Sleepless has clean goth vocals), and The Karelian Isthmus. Swallow the Sun is admittedly more accessible than those bands on their early albums, but I still don't think I would call them pop.


I think calling it pop music vocals is the wrong terminology but I do agree with him in principal.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:51 am

Jayke wrote:
Wedding in Hades wrote:
NTNR wrote:
@Wedding in Hades

I love a lot of those bands, listen harder, lol Razz


But I tried you know Very Happy
In fact my wife actually loves most of these bands.
I agree Katatonia, Anathema or Paradise Lost can do really good stuffs with great dark atmosphere, but on the other hand I'm quickly bored by their albums especially due to the vocals which sound a little too close to pop-music IMO (I mean there's a lack of aggressivity which I can't stand too long).

But I really Do Not like Amorphis & Swallow the Sun.



Vocals too close to pop music? Sounds like you're listening to the wrong releases. You would be hard pressed to find pop vocals on Lost Paradise, Dance of December Souls, Serenades (although Sleepless has clean goth vocals), and The Karelian Isthmus. Swallow the Sun is admittedly more accessible than those bands on their early albums, but I still don't think I would call them pop.


Serenades... Ok, but how many records did they release since that! Have you heard the last one ?
I've nothing against "gentle" music, but I sounds like music for teenagers in this case...

How can you judge Paradise Lost only with Lost Paradise or Gothic ? It doesn't sound like the same band anymore...

If you take the whole discography of these bands you'll find more "pop music" that Death/Doom with growl vocals. I just find most of their releases tedious, even if I can enjoy Gothic from Paradise Lost, but I wouldn't say that I like this band.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:08 am

Been discussing a similar topic with Joe Hasselvander on Facebook, he posted this funny but true message but Metallica.

"I can explain it in very simple terms! Slayer and all of their imitators through the years suck! Their fans are the same idiots that made that overrated pile of shoit, Metallica a house hold name! They also ...have a set of half ass imitators who have now blossomed into garbage like Nickleback! This crap is all a horrible fad that should have died in the cut out bins upon the release of their little miserable albums! They are only popular because they have been used as background noise for spoiled arrogant goofballs who can't get girlfriends to now have an out let for their anger in a mosh pit bumping and shoving each other! They need to just cut the crap and go to a down town gay dance club!"

Couldn't have said it better !! Well done Joe !!

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:12 am

I agree with the sentiments regarding Clutch, pornogrind, and drone, although I'm honestly not very familiar with drone. I have one Sunn O))) album, but I never really got into it that much until I saw them live. They do have a pretty big presence in that format, and having Attila Csihar on vocals definitely helped their case.

I am a big black metal guy though, and while I know that it's not everyone's cup of tea, I'm a bit surprised that it's almost universally disliked here. Bands that fuse black metal and doom, like Unholy, Dolorian, Katatonia, Bethlehem, etc..., make some of my favorite music. Not saying everyone should be into this stuff too, far from it actually, I'm just a bit surprised I'm one of the only ones.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:13 am

I love the first two Amorphis recordings (The Karelian Isthmus & The Privilege of Evil) but I cannot stand Tales From The Thousand Lakes. Which is odd because its straight up Doom/Death. I never did care for their original vocalist but he did get the job done.

Newer Anathema is garbage. I completely agree with you there. Their last album should've "We're here because we're too lame to leave".

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:17 am

Ed wrote:
Been discussing a similar topic with Joe Hasselvander on Facebook, he posted this funny but true message but Metallica.

"I can explain it in very simple terms! Slayer and all of their imitators through the years suck! Their fans are the same idiots that made that overrated pile of shoit, Metallica a house hold name! They also ...have a set of half ass imitators who have now blossomed into garbage like Nickleback! This crap is all a horrible fad that should have died in the cut out bins upon the release of their little miserable albums! They are only popular because they have been used as background noise for spoiled arrogant goofballs who can't get girlfriends to now have an out let for their anger in a mosh pit bumping and shoving each other! They need to just cut the crap and go to a down town gay dance club!"

Couldn't have said it better !! Well done Joe !!


Our singer said something similar to me when he came out to record. He said that when jocks started liking Metal is when mosh pits when from jumping up and down and everyone stopping to help someone up if they had fallen down to full on brawls. It was the meat head mentality that said it was ok for them to like the bands that they used to make fun of others for liking. They are the causal music listeners that are destroying the music industry.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:24 am

Jayke wrote:
I agree with the sentiments regarding Clutch, pornogrind, and drone, although I'm honestly not very familiar with drone. I have one Sunn O))) album, but I never really got into it that much until I saw them live. They do have a pretty big presence in that format, and having Attila Csihar on vocals definitely helped their case.

I am a big black metal guy though, and while I know that it's not everyone's cup of tea, I'm a bit surprised that it's almost universally disliked here. Bands that fuse black metal and doom, like Unholy, Dolorian, Katatonia, Bethlehem, etc..., make some of my favorite music. Not saying everyone should be into this stuff too, far from it actually, I'm just a bit surprised I'm one of the only ones.



I am no expert on black metal but it appears to have become a parody of itself. I was a big BM fan in the 80's when it first started but it seemed to stop progressing within 5 years or so. Doom Metal continues to evolve with different styles, sounds and atmospheres but BM ran out of ideas a long time ago. I have a lot of BM friends so I still hear a lot of new BM stuff but I never hear anything new, it is just recycled to death.

Drone can be very atmospheric and interesting if you have a genuine talent for it. Unfortunately most people think all you need to do is play one chord for a hour or make one long bass hum. I blame Myspace a lot for this, Drone people came out of the woodwork on there when they discovered that all they need is a guitar and a computer and they can call themselves a 'drone' artist. I am not a musician but I could make a 'drone' album with my eyes shut. The truth is most drone is pure 'anti-music' and requires very little talent.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:31 am

NTNR wrote:
Ed wrote:
Been discussing a similar topic with Joe Hasselvander on Facebook, he posted this funny but true message but Metallica.

"I can explain it in very simple terms! Slayer and all of their imitators through the years suck! Their fans are the same idiots that made that overrated pile of shoit, Metallica a house hold name! They also ...have a set of half ass imitators who have now blossomed into garbage like Nickleback! This crap is all a horrible fad that should have died in the cut out bins upon the release of their little miserable albums! They are only popular because they have been used as background noise for spoiled arrogant goofballs who can't get girlfriends to now have an out let for their anger in a mosh pit bumping and shoving each other! They need to just cut the crap and go to a down town gay dance club!"

Couldn't have said it better !! Well done Joe !!


Our singer said something similar to me when he came out to record. He said that when jocks started liking Metal is when mosh pits when from jumping up and down and everyone stopping to help someone up if they had fallen down to full on brawls. It was the meat head mentality that said it was ok for them to like the bands that they used to make fun of others for liking. They are the causal music listeners that are destroying the music industry.


Correct !!
I remember when metal-heads were just like hippes that just liked heavy music. Long haired people that were very friendly, peaceful and just after a good time. Now a lot of metal fans seem to be short-haired jocks more interested in picking a fight than enjoying the music. There was a time when you could tell a metal- fan just by looking at them, now you can't tell anymore.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:49 am

Ed wrote:

I am no expert on black metal but it appears to have become a parody of itself. I was a big BM fan in the 80's when it first started but it seemed to stop progressing within 5 years or so. Doom Metal continues to evolve with different styles, sounds and atmospheres but BM ran out of ideas a long time ago. I have a lot of BM friends so I still hear a lot of new BM stuff but I never hear anything new, it is just recycled to death.


As far as black metal becoming a parody of itself, I think that the mainstream black metal scene has proven that. However, I think black metal is just as active in the underground as doom metal in terms of expanding, varying, and reinventing itself. I can't really agree with your statement regarding BM's progression either, as it wasn't until AFTER the first 5 years that the expansion and progression really occurred. In the first 5 years we had the founders of the style, i.e. Venom, Mercyful Fate, Sodom, Hellhammer, Celtic Frost, Destruction, Bathory, etc..., but in the next 5-8 years is when it saw the most growth. First were the early interpretations of what the innovators did while morphing them into their own style, with Sarcofago, Mayhem, Tormentor, Treblinka, etc..., and then the fully realized and extremely diverse field of the early 90's. Each of the countries involved in the early black metal movement were unique among the other countries participating, but they were also extremely varied and unique WITHIN their own scenes. It wasn't until after the initial explosion of the style (2nd wave) that the next group of bands would come along and more closely imitate the styles of their immediate predecessors, rather than the immense originality spawned by the 1st and 2nd waves.

Black metal is one of my favorite genres of music, and I know I'm pretty much alone in that regard on this board, but I still feel that I should elaborate when there is a broad generalization made about it. I'm not saying that this generalization doesn't apply to black metal, as there are MANY bands out there who are just rehashing the same ideas as their heroes, but to say that it's creatively stagnant is far from true IMO. Just like with anything, you typically have to look to the underground for innovation, as more popular acts from any genre aren't typically the ones creating new sounds.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:21 am

Jayke wrote:
Ed wrote:

I am no expert on black metal but it appears to have become a parody of itself. I was a big BM fan in the 80's when it first started but it seemed to stop progressing within 5 years or so. Doom Metal continues to evolve with different styles, sounds and atmospheres but BM ran out of ideas a long time ago. I have a lot of BM friends so I still hear a lot of new BM stuff but I never hear anything new, it is just recycled to death.


As far as black metal becoming a parody of itself, I think that the mainstream black metal scene has proven that. However, I think black metal is just as active in the underground as doom metal in terms of expanding, varying, and reinventing itself. I can't really agree with your statement regarding BM's progression either, as it wasn't until AFTER the first 5 years that the expansion and progression really occurred. In the first 5 years we had the founders of the style, i.e. Venom, Mercyful Fate, Sodom, Hellhammer, Celtic Frost, Destruction, Bathory, etc..., but in the next 5-8 years is when it saw the most growth. First were the early interpretations of what the innovators did while morphing them into their own style, with Sarcofago, Mayhem, Tormentor, Treblinka, etc..., and then the fully realized and extremely diverse field of the early 90's. Each of the countries involved in the early black metal movement were unique among the other countries participating, but they were also extremely varied and unique WITHIN their own scenes. It wasn't until after the initial explosion of the style (2nd wave) that the next group of bands would come along and more closely imitate the styles of their immediate predecessors, rather than the immense originality spawned by the 1st and 2nd waves.

Black metal is one of my favorite genres of music, and I know I'm pretty much alone in that regard on this board, but I still feel that I should elaborate when there is a broad generalization made about it. I'm not saying that this generalization doesn't apply to black metal, as there are MANY bands out there who are just rehashing the same ideas as their heroes, but to say that it's creatively stagnant is far from true IMO. Just like with anything, you typically have to look to the underground for innovation, as more popular acts from any genre aren't typically the ones creating new sounds.


A couple of points here, I should have said 10 years, not 5 in relation to the progression thing. Like I said I am no expert and most of the BM I hear is the more mainstream, well known stuff and most of it just sounds like Burzum, Darkthrone etc etc. To me some BM is like comedy-metal, you see the pictures, you hear the computerized drum sounds and the monster vocals and well, it is funny stuff. I personally can't take it seriously from a musical standpoint. I need clear and concise riffs, lead solos and vocals with even just a hint of melody. Also seeing pictures of blokes in corpse paint is getting a bit silly. I remember hearing a BM corpse painted dude complaining once about KISS and their make-up and costumes ha ha, I said the BM bands you are listening to are doing the same thing, there is no difference to me. I also get CD's sent from label owners in the BM scene and it is everything I hear is very predictable but if you like BM then you will hear it different than I do.

One of the big turn-offs for me was BM fans themselves and the scenes they created. I have belong to BM forums before and it is a scene that seems to be made up of misguided directionless people looking for a way to vent their frustrations at the world but, really, it just comes across as childish foot stamping. The whole scene is full of contradictions but if these guys learnt to embrace the inherent silliness of the genre (and metal as a whole) they'd get far less wound up.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:52 am

Ed wrote:

A couple of points here, I should have said 10 years, not 5 in relation to the progression thing. Like I said I am no expert and most of the BM I hear is the more mainstream, well known stuff and most of it just sounds like Burzum, Darkthrone etc etc. To me some BM is like comedy-metal, you see the pictures, you hear the computerized drum sounds and the monster vocals and well, it is funny stuff. I personally can't take it seriously from a musical standpoint. I need clear and concise riffs, lead solos and vocals with even just a hint of melody. Also seeing pictures of blokes in corpse paint is getting a bit silly. I remember hearing a BM corpse painted dude complaining once about KISS and their make-up and costumes ha ha, I said the BM bands you are listening to are doing the same thing, there is no difference to me. I also get CD's sent from label owners in the BM scene and it is everything I hear is very predictable but if you like BM then you will hear it different than I do.

One of the big turn-offs for me was BM fans themselves and the scenes they created. I have belong to BM forums before and it is a scene that seems to be made up of misguided directionless people looking for a way to vent their frustrations at the world but, really, it just comes across as childish foot stamping. The whole scene is full of contradictions but if these guys learnt to embrace the inherent silliness of the genre (and metal as a whole) they'd get far less wound up.


Agreed, most things that you hear these days are Darkthrone and (especially) Burzum worship. There are a great deal of other things happening in BM right now, but ever since these bands, that has comprised most of the new material created. There's plenty of original stuff out there, but it's absolutely dwarfed by the sheer amount of clone bands out there. It's the same way with anyting though, a good example of that in the doom world is all of the MDB clones you've been talking about lately. However, the 1st and 2nd wave bands will always be my favorites and the most original ones out there IMO, and it's pretty sad that their name has been sullied so much by all of the idiocy within the scene, be it fans or bands.

I've NEVER thought corpsepaint was cool, but I have been a fan of black metal music for almost 10 years. The music is what does it for me, not the image, the rhetoric, or the pretentiousness. There is a great deal of rhetoric and idiocy to be found within black metal, but again, there are musicians across all of metal's genres that are arrogant, pretentious, and full of idiotic rhetoric that really serves not purpose.

I also agree that metal fans (and most especially black metal fans) need to chill out a bit. I'm dead serious about my love of the music, but that doesn't mean that every little "metal" thing needs to be taken as the word of law. Just because your favorite band says something or does something doesn't make it the only "true" or "correct" way to do or think anything. You've got to take everything with a grain of salt, because we're all different and we're all messed up and wrong in different ways.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Wed Mar 16, 2011 12:32 pm

I totally agree with you there. I am also into the first wave of bands in all genres. All music goes through that cycle, innovators, the b-league and then comes the clone bands. People are always waiting around for the new wave of innovators to come along but I am pretty sure, it may not ever happen. I don't want to sound like a old grump (which I am lol) but everything has truly been done. Now it is up to bands to be as original or unique as they can with the blueprints they have presented with and run with it. It is interesting that the truly unique bands in doom-metal are mostly the ones that people generally have trouble with. People complain about Sabbath-clones but that is what most still want to hear.

With BM I think it is kind of sad that most people still think of church burnings and Satanism when it comes to BM music. There is some great music going on but most people will never hear it because of the preconceptions they have on the BM scene. Doom Metal has its own problems too and anything labeled stoner-rock gets a bad rap from people who think it is only music for drug taking freaks. The media is partly to blame but fans themselves have screwed things up by pushing the dope smoking angle all the time and ignoring the actual music.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 6:14 am

The best BM band ever is/was Venom. What a Face

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 7:26 am

I think I already did a post about this but I saw Venom when I was in the UK in the 80's. They were really really bad but good at the same time lol. It was total spinal tap stuff.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:14 am

Saw Venom in 85..with Voivod and the Cro Mags...It was Voivods FIRST american show ever...fucking amazing all 3 of them

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:23 am

Soggy Bob wrote:
Saw Venom in 85..with Voivod and the Cro Mags...It was Voivods FIRST American show ever...fucking amazing all 3 of them


Voivod is a band I can't stand, lol. Jayke and I have had many arguments about them (he's a big fan).

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:30 am

When I saw Venom they were getting a lot of negative press about how they couldn't play blah blah blah and I used to defend them even though it was obvious they were pretty rough musicians. Seeing them live though made me realize how bad they actually were. Cronos couldn't play bass, most of the time he just hacked away on one string, not even holding a note usually. Mantas hit bum notes in every song and his solos were so messy that a lot of the time, he would lose his place and then just improvise to get to the end of that section. The look on his face was hilarious because you could tell he was thinking ' oh shoit, fucked up again' ha ha

The drumming went slow, fast, was never steady and never in time and he dropped sticks frequently. The sound was extremely loud but didn't sound mixed at all like the dude on the mixing went home after the first song. The only song that sounded tight was 'Seven Gates Of Hell,' the rest of the set was sloppy as shoit. The stage production was total spinal tap with some things working, some things only half worked and some things didn't work at all including several lights that blew out during the first song. Despite all this though, it was great fun and a great night that I will never forget.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:31 am

NTNR wrote:
Soggy Bob wrote:
Saw Venom in 85..with Voivod and the Cro Mags...It was Voivods FIRST American show ever...fucking amazing all 3 of them


Voivod is a band I can't stand, lol. Jayke and I have had many arguments about them (he's a big fan).



I wasn't a big fan till I saw them on the 'nothing face' tour, they blew me away and my opinion of them changed forever. The drumming especially was incredible.

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:01 am

True, I do adore Voivod. That's a band that truly is progressive, not like the hordes of Dream Theater clones that think progression somehow equates to lining up right behind your idols.

As far as Venom being the best BM band out there, I can't really agree. I love Venom, but there's lots of other BM out there I would listen to first. Venom is an odd case, where the band that created the template was easily surpassed by MANY of the bands that they influenced.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 1:27 pm

To me Venom were just a raw, noisy, punky version of Motorhead cranked to 11 etc, the BM tag came from their lyrics more than anything else. In the early 80's punk kids loved them even though punk magazines like "Maximum Rock N' Roll" hated them. Venom started the satanic image/lyric thing but real BM music started a year or two later. So many bands rip them off too, the first two Bathory albums had rip offs of venom songs for example and then Quothorn denied being influenced by them which I always thought was BS.

It is interesting that when Welcome To Hell was released a Danish metal mag said Venom were a cross between Discharge and Black Flag and was crude punk with satanic lyrics. A lot of people at the time thought they had nothing to do with heavy metal.


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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 1:52 pm

Ed wrote:
To me Venom were just a raw, noisy, punky version of Motorhead cranked to 11 etc, the BM tag came from their lyrics more than anything else. In the early 80's punk kids loved them even though punk magazines like "Maximum Rock N' Roll" hated them. Venom started the satanic image/lyric thing but real BM music started a year or two later. So many bands rip them off too, the first two Bathory albums had rip offs of venom songs for example and then Quothorn denied being influenced by them which I always thought was BS.

It is interesting that when Welcome To Hell was released a Danish metal mag said Venom were a cross between Discharge and Black Flag and was crude punk with satanic lyrics. A lot of people at the time thought they had nothing to do with heavy metal.


When describing Venom to my friends, I've always simply said "Motorhead + Satan = Venom". Obviously BM has come a long way since Venom, but they were definitely black metal. There's a certain mentality these days from many younger metal fans (some are admittedly from my generation) that just because bands and sounds that have evolved far from their roots, like with modern black metal, that the bands at the root are now excluded from that sound. It's a pretty idiotic mentality, just because some 3rd rate Burzum clone sounds nothing like Venom means Venom isn't black metal? I call BS. Some of the worst atrocities when facing this mentality are the singling out the true founders of a sound or style as "no longer heavy/fast/evil/metal enough" to make the cut, when the stuff they're listening to wouldn't be around without these guys. Deep Purple is no longer heavy metal, Venom is no longer black metal, Possessed is no longer death metal, Pentagram is no longer doom metal, the list goes on and on.

It genuinely makes me sad that so many metal fans possess this mentality. Why would you want to be divisive and exclude many of the bands that created the current stuff that you love? It doesn't make any sense to me, as when I hear a certain sound that I like, I tend to go to the origin and find out where it came from. As you said, the earliest stuff is often the best stuff, and while some may come along to improve upon the formula later, they seldom possess the raw creativity of the originators.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 1:54 pm

I really can't stand Tool. People always rave about how awesome they are. but I find them coma-inducing boring. I have two of their releases, Aenima and Lateralus, and a few years back, I decided to listen to both of them every day, for a period of ten days, or so, in order to find what made them so awesome. What a waste of time. After spinning each CD ten times, I still could not recall a single song, its lyrics or melodies. As if they try to make their music as an-catchy as possible. Still, I give them credit for being decent background music, since it is not intrusive, lacking the ability to suck you in.

Meshuggah - Just plain mechanized noise, imo.

Nevermore - Annoying! Since when did Warrel Dane turned into such a whiner?

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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 2:16 pm

I know that I'm in the minority with this one (what else is new?), but Tool is one of my favorite bands. They're not really a metal band so I can understand that most metal fans don't like them, but there's just something about them that I have loved since the first time I heard them. They were pretty much my gateway into music, which could have something to do with it, but even after exploring many different sounds they remain one of my favorites.
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PostSubject: Re: Bands you just can't get into.   Thu Mar 17, 2011 3:20 pm

N.W.O.O.F.G.M. wrote:
I really can't stand Tool. People always rave about how awesome they are. but I find them coma-inducing boring. I have two of their releases, Aenima and Lateralus, and a few years back, I decided to listen to both of them every day, for a period of ten days, or so, in order to find what made them so awesome. What a waste of time. After spinning each CD ten times, I still could not recall a single song, its lyrics or melodies. As if they try to make their music as an-catchy as possible. Still, I give them credit for being decent background music, since it is not intrusive, lacking the ability to suck you in.


I couldn't agree more. To me they've been writing the same song for 10+ years.

Meshuggah has their moments. Chaosphere & Obzen are amazing albums, the rest are take or leave. Nevermore was sheer brilliance until their last album. They showed the world what Power Metal could sound like. Dark, classy, heavy, awesome, etc... They're last album was just awful. Warrel's solo album was excellent, it's a lighter version of what Nevermore could've sounded like on their last effort but didn't. I think the reason for the filler is the reunion of Sanctuary. They were a cool band but they don't need to make a new album and tour. They all went their separate ways and that should've been the end of it but no....

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